Sunday, 27 January 2008
House of Lords, Deaf Discussion and Plan Marches.
British Sign Language (English Translation)
Hello Islington Deaf Campaign, hope you are all well. I will concluse list of things I will provide in this vlog. I now need to start to show (announcement) House of Lords
Lord Turnberg: “…it is possible to have that as part of a syndrome in which the child is badly deformed, DEAF….” HFEB Bill 2007, 21 January 2007, at 3.30pm please visit www.parliament.uk
This note means genetics in House of Lords has been discussed and bad attitudes from Lords [regarding deaf], embryos are been found as deaf deformed genes will be removed. Now I am considering, look at the picture
(Stephen Hawking picture)
That is what means that who are really famous, world genius in astronomy physics. His disability is deformed but his genes were not removed, but compare to deaf yes.
I want to launch a demonstration march in 1st week of April. Wednesday or Saturday. If you want to feedback which Wednesday or Saturday is best? Why Wednesday, there is regular meeting from Prime Minister Questions, demonstration can be shown by MPs and Lords outside. Or Saturday we can continue on a march but MPs or Lords not working on Saturday. Your opinions please feedback to us.
I will plan to provide petition form and launch within this blog with the form. Please can you fill the petition form and give to anyone the petition form in UK with information. Please fill with your address, post code and signatures, all on the form and send back to us.
When I collect all and I will count the petition, and I will announce the count of people sign on the petition. The government are interested to demands more than 2,000 people signatures. When I got all and we will meet the MP in Parliament, Health MP and give to them.
I am serious to take this responsibility and focus action move on, not off the point; I am direct to the point. 1. Deaf genes removed, 2. BSL Rights, 3. Education for deaf children, it is very important because many mainstream schools and increasing more and deaf special schools disappeared.
That is why you all need to go back and start to march!
I have been researching, from a book that Paddy Ladd wrote, “Understanding Deaf Culture”, Paddy has research deaf culture, many things we both agree, but there are some new information, interesting it is Paddy’s opinion are different from my opinions, it is my views.
I have been research on “deaf”, I thought it was good word. No, have to be careful with this word. Deaf. What does it means? It is same as Deafness. It is a medical word. Mind like stupid, can’t hear like stupid. Two of them.
I want to describe Deafmute. That is who you are, as a person. That seems is very positive attitude, it is not negative. In deaf community they thought it is negative. No, it is not. Why? It is Hearing control influence all, it is “COLONISATION”.
It does means many deaf people become low confidence, lots of million deaf people all over. Where is confidence and strong? Nothing. Please come back build confidence. All Deaf back to demonstration march.
March will definitely on April. I already discussed with Police and agree to arrange for this march. They need registration so what is why you please feedback what date, time do you want us to march. (In April). When you feedback to say specifics, then I will provide another vlog to say definite details.
Please I say at the moment I do not have office. We got limit budget. Soon we will get our office then we will let you know. We are on the way to get funding but not yet, it will be in April.
We want demonstration march now. If you want to donate, please do, we will provide details on website. Donation, it does not means we do not keep money for other reasons. It is for demonstration march. It is separate issue, we will use financial recording. We got funding which focus on community; we use the HSBC account which is for Islington Deaf Campaign which Committee manage only. Some of them, we can use it for demonstration march (evidence record to show separate). It is Honest. If you want to donate and do that, we will make sure that your name is recorded and announced in financial statement show your support. If we have more money left after spending, then we will keep the money for next year demonstration march again.
Thank you for everything information I have provided. Please feedback to us.
Hang on. I need to consider why you all watch the vlog, 350 people did watch, didn’t contact us. If it was my attitude, it was not. Please do not focus on personality, please focus on ACTION. Unity! All deaf people in together. It is very important; please do not focus on personality. Thank you. Bye.
HSBC ISLINGTON DEAF CAMPAIGN REF: DONATE MARCHES
SORT CODE: 40-03-33,
ACCOUNT NUMBER: 61581708
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21 comments:
GOOD WORK
why don't you work with the stopeugenics team and stop stealing all their hard work?
Fight for your freedom of being Deaf!!! Stay on course! I support your cause all the way!
I'm NOT sure if I agree with this number 1. Deaf genes removed,
I agreed with that number 2. BSL Rights,
I agreed with that number 3. Education for deaf children, it is very important because many mainstream schools and increasing more and deaf special schools disappeared.
I am not sure about number 1... Still sticky issues..
We would like to respond to each comments.
1. deafsingle - thank you very much, we aim to work hard, and would like all to contribute their support on demonstration march.
2. anonymous (1) - We aim to work with all organisations and happy to cooperate with them. We got legal constitution that will support Islington Deaf people (outside Islington are welcome). We already said Unity, work deaf people together. It was not true that we did steal their work, as we collect information from our research and information alone. In the first clip, we have quote stopeugenics blog and respect all.
3. Yes, I really appreciate your words especially Freedom to fight. Why not you can start to collect signatures from petition, and donate if possible. We will keep inform you information and vlog.
4. Anonymous (2) I am glad that you have agreed with 2, and 3. Number 1 is very important to deaf community because the Government is introducing the Bill at the moment, will prevent deaf people to have deaf children from IVF or able to donate their deaf genes to relatives or other person. It affect the attitudes of House of Lords, MP and RNId, that they believe it is illness to be Deaf / Deafmute. It would be good to know your name so we can answer further.
We will not answer questions to anonymous in detail because IDC will answer direct to people with names because of our constitution.
We look forward to recieve other comments or questions. Thank you very much.
Islington Deaf Campaign.
I wouldn't offer support personally as a deaf person, because I believe most parents or prospective IVF parents would not choose a deaf child anyway, and the deaf parent themselves have chosen, to abort disabled foetus's in the past, so it looks hypocritical to me at least.
Nobody has produced via the eugenics campaigns and blogs,a single deaf parent undertaking IVF, SEE HEAR still can't find one. If the campaign is to be successful you have to violate patient ethics to find out how IVF couples feel, and this is illegal.
I rather suspect the deaf don't really want to know either....
MM
Dear MM
Thank you for your message.
You are misunderstood, you need to contact other organisations whether they have known about this campaign.
Islington Deaf Campaign is very keen to work with other organisations, and welcome to the discussion. IDC think See Hear should be filming on this topic, and make sure it is spread to deaf people all over the Britain. IDC is happy to partipate in any interview arranged by See Hear. MM, can you contact See Hear and ask them to film? See Hear Discussion removed my posting twice, which I feel they block the information to spread about this. Why did See Hear Block?
Donation is not profit for us, Donation will help us to organise for march, materials, papers, leaflets and send information etc... very important to understand we do not have any budget, and the spending on donation will strict for only march.
Please do not blame to IDC or deaf people, we should use our fight and blame to the Government instead.
We are surprised that deaf people support to deaf genes to be removed.
We think deaf people need to careful, thinking about deaf genes how it will affect to us and our next generation of deaf children. We have met some deaf people who still did not know that there is Bill on the Parliament. That is why we need proper discussion.
We do not think it is illegial to ask deaf parents to contribue their views, and we can request Freedom of Information to get information about stats regarding to this and it is legal.
We believe you do not have any evidence that deaf parents would choose to remove deaf genes. Do you have any evidence?
Islington Deaf Campaign.
The fact remains this stop eugenics campaign has not attempted to work or consult with potential IVF parents on any level. They are by-passing the main people to go over their head. The bottom line is ONLY IVF users are in any real position to make a choice, I've not even read opposition to the removal of the deaf gene on IVF message boards.
IVF is a very difficult and heart-breaking issue, there are so many failures, and tellingly multiple births and a high number of severely disabled children with little life expectancy being born, it's heartbreak for these women.
I don't feel comfortable deaf people view their own sector more worthy than that of disabled people, many of us need considerable support too, and there is no way of getting around that.
The final decision will not even affect us at all, or what we need now, there will be fewer deaf born that's all, but that's a trend now as well.
Ask any parent what it wants for their child.... you cannot get away from the reality of the majority answer to that. Are deaf taking up IVF even ? we just don't know. The whole campaign seems based on removal of the deaf gene, yet, many other disability genes are also in the pipeline for removal of choice too, I believe they are responding to the majority view of parents. Those who fight on the premise we are being attacked are wrong, it affects NOBODY alive now,and IVF babies are minuscule in number compared with mainstream and natural child birth. It has come about, because, parents with serious disabled children have tried to sue IVF teams, you're real 'targets' are insurance companies, and trying to persuade parents having a deaf child is not a problem, you have done neither, you know parents are not going to listen to deaf cultural people. Would deaf parents listen to hearing ones ?
MM
Dear MM
Thank you very much for a good response.
As you see that we understood from your point and we have now requested IDC from any deaf parents who have been through IVF experiences, hopefully they will approach and describe their experiences. We took your point on how difficult experience that women go through IVF and agreed to that point.
Therefore, we must also wide the audience to feedback on this campaign. MM, you were not aware of the other aspect of the Clause 14(4)(8-9) of the Bill which we will addressed here:-
Deaf person with deaf genes who would like to donate their embryo to a deaf or hearing person, deaf person is not allowed through if the law is passed. It is not just women who go through IVF, it is also wide to the deaf population who would volunteer to donate to hearing or deaf person.
Why are the favourism to hearing community not deaf community ... hearing allow to have hearing children at any costs ... hearing or deaf not allow to have deaf children through IVF experience or donate to other person with deaf genes? In many deaf people's views that it would disrupt deaf people's rights to have their children.
That is why we want to march to demonstrate our objections to the Bill, and getting BSL recogntion legally, and focus on deaf education.
On the See Hear programme a certain Baroness rambled on about deaf children/people not being able to listen to Mozart. It seems she forgot that Beethoven was deaf and he was a brilliant musician. Someone should put to this Baroness what she thought of Beethoven?
I am firmly agree with you, I felt Baroness Deech are murder to Deaf Community.
welldone anyway please keep in touch to pim !! who sign on my tube hi to pim how are you iam shock you well !! keep in touch other e mail thanks wow wow you keep fight for stop cut bACK AND I NEED OLD SCHOOLS BACK ALSO STOP WORSE MAINSTREAM SCHOOL I HATE THAT I AM SUPPORT TO YOU THANKS
Dear David,
We agree with you that, we need more deaf schools to be opened and less mainstream schools, that is why we need more deaf people to download petition form from our blog, and ask people to sign them.
In one of the requirements. To have focus to Deaf Education and deaf children to be provided in full access (BSL & bilingualism). You can download from our blog - petition form.
Thank you for your comment.
Are you marching to oppose the entire HFEB Bill?
Do you realise that you will end up doing more harm than good - for example parts of the Bill allows for gays to adopt children which is a good thing. Gays will never support your campagin here. There are other clauses that does good things, but by opposing the entire bill, you oppose all of above.
The StopEugenics campagin only oppose a specific clause in the bill, but not the bill itself. You said you're willing to work with them, yet you've never gotten in touch why not?
Dear Joe,
Please do stop twisting the words - we make it clear please stop the Government for removing deaf genes.
Yes, we are welcome Stop Eugenics to contact us, discuss about this issue. Yes. Welcome.
Joe actually does have a point, in that the focus (was), on the deaf gene rights, at the expence of the rights of various other sectors, perhaps it was unintentional, but others may feel you are only interested in the deaf aspect.
I think ID deaf people were allowed to donate sperm containingthe deaf gene, then the IVF team would have a legal obligation to inform the parents, who would then anyway refuse it.
Are you aware that today, there is such a low donation of sperm, they are IMPORTING it from Norway and places like that ? This is because the British law allows donors to lose anonymity, so many now won't donate.
Are they importing deaf sperm too ? The issue of deaf sperm donors is also undocumented,and I believe largely unproven so far.
MM
Thank you MM for your comment.
The issue we raised for deaf genes are removed from the new legislation if it is passed.
If people were unintentional, they need to know, by our campaign is about deaf people. We focus on Clause 14(4)(8-9) which raised "deafness" that can be affected greatly on Deaf Community.
If the Bill become legislation, this means deaf people can't donate, and the deaf sperms are not allowed to pass to other person to make a child. This means deaf people lose rights to donate. It is also applied to IVF, and deaf genes and other issues.
Thank you for raising the issue whether it is low sperms, or whether people won't donate becuase their information about identity is shared, we need to focus the Government to stop introducing this to be legislation. After it become law, deaf people cannot donate, or able to give deaf children.
We need to March on April 12!
I'm obliged for your patience. I am a little confused regarding the passing on or donation of the deaf gene. If a deaf couple have low sperm or damaged eggs, then they can surely advertise outside the IVF program for a deaf donation ? Or simply DIY ? This is what the deaf lesbians did (Not via IVF), but in order toget a deaf baby. As Iunderstand it the IVF progam allows the donation of deaf sprem TO deaf people, it suggests they can't to hearing. Is it not better from the 'Deaf' view that a deaf child, has deaf parents anyway ? Can you accept that a hearing parent has the right to refuse to carry a deaf child ? This seems to be the area, you don't want them to know they will be carrying one, is this not deceit ? They have a right to know, now the means to ID are there.
Thank you again.
MM
We welcome any comments or questions, no problem.
We understand your queries about deaf should have to deaf, and hearing should have hearing child. This is dangerous area that it should not played about. The Bill is about deafness, it is about deaf child, not about hearing child. The bill clearly state deafness.
The doctors already deceit about how influence to hearing and deaf, about not have a deaf child and removing deaf genes.
We will have some more vlogs to explain more about this area shortly.
Thank you.
hey thank you information about this...so i am angry for government and i would like to help you anything if u want to. : )
that i want go support anything this cause right deaf genes but i dont want like abortion if deaf how was cruel. coz i had care to join us by facebook from friends about each 69. i hope hear from them confirm on 12 April at waterloo. cioa tkx xxx
hey thank you information about this...so i am angry for government and i would like to help you anything if u want to. : )
that i want go support this cause for reason that i dont want happend aportion if deaf. WON'T DO IT APORTION HOW CRUEL GOVERNMENT!!
....coz i care plan to join us by facebook of my friends about each 69. i hope hear from them confirm on 12 April at waterloo. cioa tkx xxx
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